For Koritz And Dino

[acududeman]

Rob & Dino,

I am a fellow drummer and deadhead. I saw roughly 35 GD shows and have seen DSO at least as many times. I want to thank you for your awesome drumming skills and your commitment to recreating and furthur evolving the music of the GD.

I've been wanting to ask you guys some technical questions for years now. So here goes.....

1) What kind of heads do you guys use on your drums? Do you change the heads depending on the GD era you are recreating?

2) Do you change the tuning on your drums and/or cymbals depending on the GD era you are recreating?

3) Do you own any percussion equipment that was previously owned and played by Mickey or Billy? I was thinking mainly of cymbals.

4) I completely dig the cymbal sound that you guys both get. I imagine some of that is due to miking techniques. It appears that, like the GD, you guys both play Zildjians. What size cymbals are they? Are they newer or are they vintage Zildjians?

5) As for drum tuning, again I dig the sound of your drums themselves. Do you tune your drums differently for GD music than you would to play with another band of another style?

That's alot of questions, but I'm a drum nerd and always a student of life. Thanks again for doing what you do. I'll see you on NYE in Baltimore

peace, acududeman.

[Guest DEAD HEAD]

acududeman, you questions are stellar ... its interesting to know what hard working touring drummers are using and doing to achieve their sound ... I'm a drum nerd too ...

[acududeman]

acududeman, you questions are stellar ... its interesting to know what hard working touring drummers are using and doing to achieve their sound ... I'm a drum nerd too ...

Dead Head......Greetings!

I saw your pics of your Pearl Reference kit the other day, and I recognize those pics from the Pearl Reference forum site......too cool.

Guess what......I recently picked up my own Reference kit (in Purple Craze). It's new and barely broken in, but I'll probably gig with it for the first time in December. It's pretty sweet. Anyway, nice to (virtually) meet you. BTW, you planning to go to NYE in Baltimore?

[Guest DEAD HEAD]

Dead Head......Greetings!

I saw your pics of your Pearl Reference kit the other day, and I recognize those pics from the Pearl Reference forum site......too cool.

Guess what......I recently picked up my own Reference kit (in Purple Craze). It's new and barely broken in, but I'll probably gig with it for the first time in December. It's pretty sweet. Anyway, nice to (virtually) meet you. BTW, you planning to go to NYE in Baltimore?

acududeman,it is such a small world and very nice to (virtually) meet you also ... Enjoy your new Ref Kit ,your gonna love it and Purple Craze looks amazing under stage lighting...Ive had my Reference kit for a little over 2 years now and have sat behind some other very expensive custom kits during this time and nothing else compares ... As far as heads go , I'm using Evans G2's (clear) over Evans Resonants on all my toms ,Aquarian SK2 and reso combo on the kick and Evans Genera Dry on my snares. My tuning is fairly standard for the types of music I play ( somewhat low ) , you'll find these drums have great tuning range though and I'm going to guess that we have very similar taste in music ... I wont be making it to NYE but I'll be at Nokia for both nights , Wayne next Sat and maybe Lancaster and the show on Dec 30th wherever that may be ... Shoot me a pm if your going to be at any of these shows and we'll hook up ... Peace,Mike

[Guest DEAD HEAD]

Happy Thanksgiving !

[Guest DEAD HEAD]

acududeman,I hope you don't mind me posting these pics on your thread but I thought you might find them interesting ...The first pic is of me and mrpaiste(Don) discussing the fundamentals of the Ref kit .The second pic is jpc(Josh) jamming on the kit (its his kit and band )and the 3rd pic is mrp(Don) taking the ref kit for a run.The 3rd pic shows how good Purple Craze looks outside and those pics were taken during set up and sound check at a rather LARGE party in Falls Church VA and the name of Josh's band is Perfect Tuesday , it was a fun day of drum talk and music ...

[Grateful_Bruno]

another great looking Pearl Reference Kit! N I C E !

[Vortex]

Rob & Dino,

I am a fellow drummer and deadhead. I saw roughly 35 GD shows and have seen DSO at least as many times. I want to thank you for your awesome drumming skills and your commitment to recreating and furthur evolving the music of the GD.

I've been wanting to ask you guys some technical questions for years now. So here goes.....

1) What kind of heads do you guys use on your drums? Do you change the heads depending on the GD era you are recreating?

2) Do you change the tuning on your drums and/or cymbals depending on the GD era you are recreating?

3) Do you own any percussion equipment that was previously owned and played by Mickey or Billy? I was thinking mainly of cymbals.

4) I completely dig the cymbal sound that you guys both get. I imagine some of that is due to miking techniques. It appears that, like the GD, you guys both play Zildjians. What size cymbals are they? Are they newer or are they vintage Zildjians?

5) As for drum tuning, again I dig the sound of your drums themselves. Do you tune your drums differently for GD music than you would to play with another band of another style?

That's alot of questions, but I'm a drum nerd and always a student of life. Thanks again for doing what you do. I'll see you on NYE in Baltimore

peace, acududeman.

Hey acudeman!

[acududeman]

Hey acudeman!

[acududeman]

Hey acudeman!

[robbok3]

Thanks for the questions. Let me try and run it down.

Heads- I played remo for 25+ years. Recently, I switched to Evans. It kind of happened by accident, but I find they offer a little more consistency (sp?) from batch to batch. I really felt REMOs quality control was slipping. I am still trying different combinations, but I seem to be settling into clear G2s on top and G1s on the bottom. My snares have Genera Dry on top and 300 mil hazy on the bottoms. The kick has the EQ 3 on the batter and a single ply black on the front. I have a felt strip running down the side of the batter head (old school) plus a pillow the just barely touches both heads.

I have a pitch and sound that I like the best, but I do tweak them a little, depending on what we are playing. I tighten them up a little for the single drummer stuff, trying to get a little more resonant, jazzy tone. For the late 80s stuff, I bring them down a little and try to get the fattest, wettest sound I can. I change the heads about once a tour, although I would like to change them more. I also use some moongel for dampening, although lately have been using a little more than usual. Healy would love for me to use even more.

My cymbal set up changes quite a bit, depending on the era. Mickey was always toying with something. Some nights I have 1 ride, sometimes two, and in the 90s just one, but on my left side. I am a Zildjian man through and through. Always have been. Almost exclusively A's, but lately I have really come to like the A custom crashes. I have some K rides, but those stay at home and get used mostly for jazz gigs when I am off the road.

Right now the road set-up consists of 14" A new beat hats that I have played since 1981, or 13" K/Z combo hats. The crash to my left is a 17" A custom Medium. The one to my right is a 18"A medium crash, and if I am using a third, it is a 18 A medium thin on my far right. The rides are a 20" A medium that I have also had since 1981. That is on my right. If I am using one on the left as well, it is a 20" A Deep ride. Has a ton of definition but isn't too dry. The bell is a bit smaller that my ideal but the cymbal sounds great. On occasion, I also have a 17" Wuhan china on my far left.

Other than the cymbals that Dino has, the only other stuff I have directly from the source are the tools I use on the Beam and the strings on the beam. I picked them up at auction a few years ago.

I think tuning is a very personal thing. No two people do it the same. As I said earlier, I have a certain sound that I am going for, but different styles of music call for different tunings, to some degree. It really just needs to blend with everything else real nice. Different drums have different optimum tunings, as well. That all has to do with wood type, bearing edges and head combinations.

I hope this answers at least some of your questions. Let me know if I can be of any more help.

PEACE--ROB

[acududeman]

Thanks for the questions. Let me try and run it down.

Heads- I played remo for 25+ years. Recently, I switched to Evans. It kind of happened by accident, but I find they offer a little more consistency (sp?) from batch to batch. I really felt REMOs quality control was slipping. I am still trying different combinations, but I seem to be settling into clear G2s on top and G1s on the bottom. My snares have Genera Dry on top and 300 mil hazy on the bottoms. The kick has the EQ 3 on the batter and a single ply black on the front. I have a felt strip running down the side of the batter head (old school) plus a pillow the just barely touches both heads.

I have a pitch and sound that I like the best, but I do tweak them a little, depending on what we are playing. I tighten them up a little for the single drummer stuff, trying to get a little more resonant, jazzy tone. For the late 80s stuff, I bring them down a little and try to get the fattest, wettest sound I can. I change the heads about once a tour, although I would like to change them more. I also use some moongel for dampening, although lately have been using a little more than usual. Healy would love for me to use even more.

My cymbal set up changes quite a bit, depending on the era. Mickey was always toying with something. Some nights I have 1 ride, sometimes two, and in the 90s just one, but on my left side. I am a Zildjian man through and through. Always have been. Almost exclusively A's, but lately I have really come to like the A custom crashes. I have some K rides, but those stay at home and get used mostly for jazz gigs when I am off the road.

Right now the road set-up consists of 14" A new beat hats that I have played since 1981, or 13" K/Z combo hats. The crash to my left is a 17" A custom Medium. The one to my right is a 18"A medium crash, and if I am using a third, it is a 18 A medium thin on my far right. The rides are a 20" A medium that I have also had since 1981. That is on my right. If I am using one on the left as well, it is a 20" A Deep ride. Has a ton of definition but isn't too dry. The bell is a bit smaller that my ideal but the cymbal sounds great. On occasion, I also have a 17" Wuhan china on my far left.

Other than the cymbals that Dino has, the only other stuff I have directly from the source are the tools I use on the Beam and the strings on the beam. I picked them up at auction a few years ago.

I think tuning is a very personal thing. No two people do it the same. As I said earlier, I have a certain sound that I am going for, but different styles of music call for different tunings, to some degree. It really just needs to blend with everything else real nice. Different drums have different optimum tunings, as well. That all has to do with wood type, bearing edges and head combinations.

I hope this answers at least some of your questions. Let me know if I can be of any more help.

PEACE--ROB

Very nice.......thanks Rob. Do you guys have a drum tech who handles drum set-up and head tuning etc or do you handle all that yourself?

So looking forward to NYE !!!

reid.

reid.

[robbok3]

Very nice.......thanks Rob. Do you guys have a drum tech who handles drum set-up and head tuning etc or do you handle all that yourself?

So looking forward to NYE !!!

reid.

reid.

Dino and I have some help. but not a dedicated drum tech. We do a fair amount of the setup and tear down ourselves. Maintenance also. As for tuning, I would probably do it myself regardless of having a full time tech.

[Guest DEAD HEAD]

" I am a Zildjian man through and through. Always have been. Almost exclusively A's, but lately I have really come to like the A custom crashes."

Zildjian cymbals are the best and A custom crashes sound amazing ! I'm using a 14" fast crash , 16" medium crash and an 18" projection crash ... Thanks for the great replies Rob and Dino ... Mike

[acududeman]

" I am a Zildjian man through and through. Always have been. Almost exclusively A's, but lately I have really come to like the A custom crashes."

Zildjian cymbals are the best and A custom crashes sound amazing ! I'm using a 14" fast crash , 16" medium crash and an 18" projection crash ... Thanks for the great replies Rob and Dino ... Mike

Rob/Dino,

What about snare drums? How often do you guys switch out your snare depending on the show you're "recreating"? What sizes and materials are your working snare drums?

From what I can sonically tell, Bill & Mickey went to a progressively fatter snare sound as time wore on. I really dig the snappy snare sound from 60's GD (Ludwig Supraphonic perhaps?). The Allman Bros drummers had the same snare sound in their early recordings. The snare sound of 80's GD sounded like a deep wooden snare (8" depth?). Anyway, just curious what you guys have to share about the "snare drum scene". Thanks!

peace, reid.

[robbok3]

Rob/Dino,

What about snare drums? How often do you guys switch out your snare depending on the show you're "recreating"? What sizes and materials are your working snare drums?

From what I can sonically tell, Bill & Mickey went to a progressively fatter snare sound as time wore on. I really dig the snappy snare sound from 60's GD (Ludwig Supraphonic perhaps?). The Allman Bros drummers had the same snare sound in their early recordings. The snare sound of 80's GD sounded like a deep wooden snare (8" depth?). Anyway, just curious what you guys have to share about the "snare drum scene". Thanks!

peace, reid.

Just home from tour today. Thanks to everyone who spent their hard-earned dough to come out and see us. It is MUCH appreciated.

So, snare drums............. I am not a huge snare drum freak, as many drummers are. I own 11 right now. While that might seem like a lot, I have friends who own anywhere from 5-30. I only have two on the road with me. I thnk Dino has 3 or 4 out. He just got a new one, which sounds real good.

As far as what I am using with DSO, primarily, I am using my old trusted baby. It is a 6.5x14 Tama Mastercraft Maple. I bought it in the mid 80's and it has been #1 ever since. You may be detecting a pattern with me. When I find stuff I like, I stick with it. Hell, my bass drum pedal is 20+ years old. Keep it clean and oiled, and it will last forever. I digress. Back to the snare.

I pretty much use it for all two drummer shows. Dino usually uses a maple for these shows, too. It seems to work, because they blend together well. We don't really want one cracking more than the other. His new one and my Tama seem to work great together.

So the Tama is fairly beat up. Not so pretty to look at, but it sounds great. I have had to replace lugs with some that don't match, due to the diffuculty in finding the right older lugs. It has an internal muffler(replaced a few times over the years) that I keep just a little tighter than barely touching the head. Recently, with Dan at the helm, I have also been putting about a quarter square of Moongel right underneath where the mic is over the head. Evans Genera coated on top, tuned medium to medium high. 300 mil clear on the bottom, tuned medium high, but detuned a bit on the rods on either side of the snare wires. I picked this up in a magazine when I was a kid, and it seems to make sense for me. It gives me what I feel is a pretty sensitve drum, but not a lot of the thinness that usually accompanies that. I equate that thinner more sensitive sound to alot of jazz drummers.

Having said that, when I play the single drummer shows, I use the other snare I have on the road. It is 5.5 x13 GMS maple that I bought with the kit. It is pitched a good deal higher than the Tama and because it is a 13 has much more crack when I lay into it. It is pretty sensitive and works really well in the single drummer setting. It is the only drum(on the road) that still has a Remo head on it. It has a coated ambassador that is tuned pretty tight. I haven't changed it because I love the sound, and I don't want to lose it. The head has been on there for a couple of years (keep in mind it doesn't get used all that often)and has a "bald spot" in the middle. Old style jazz like. You look at Elvin and some of those guys who played with the heads cranked pretty tight, and they would leve heads on there for years if they liked the sound. The bottom head is tight and I don't detune around the snares. This keeps it really sensitive for the ghost notes and buzz rolls.

The drums I have at home run the gamut. Maple, birch, bubinga, aluminum, a piccolo, and even an old Ludwig acrolite, that I started with when I was seven. To this day I have not found a drum with a better cross-stick sound.

I know this was a bit long winded, but I hope it answered your questions. Thanks for the interest.

PEACE-ROB

[Grateful_Bruno]

Dino and Rob - thanks so much for taking time to answer these various drum, cymbal and tech questions. Like the other members of this band, you are very professional but take the time out to come here on these boards and interact with the loyal fans as well. I find your answers not only interesting but also educational. ...I had always wondered too if some of the cymbals you use were authentic GD cymbals. You guys are great and its cool you replied on this very interesting post. I am a Zyldjian user through and through also, and had a early 70's era Ludwig large scale set with 24" kick and finsihing out with 18" and 20" floor toms. I also purchased a Roland Handsonic with both high hat and kick drum trigger pedals. Amazing instrument. can't wait til my next DSO show.. . Since Healy has come on board, the DRUMS segments have really come alive and the sound is incredible. Keep on drummin'...

[Vortex]

So snare drums

[Guest DEAD HEAD]

Dino your new snare sounds crazy, over an inch of rolled maple , thats sick ... I have a 13x6.5 Pearl Reference snare thats over an inch thick but its 20 plys of maple ... Does Chris Jennings have a web site to check this snare out (?) I'm very interested in seeing and maybe purchasing one ...

Dino and Rob - What will you both be doing for the next 18 or so days till next show as far as drum practice ... do you spend a little time per day on the kit or drum pads ... do you guys still take some lessons during DSO breaks or do you have a side project that you gig with ?

[robbok3]

Dino your new snare sounds crazy, over an inch of rolled maple , thats sick ... I have a 13x6.5 snare thats over an inch thick but its 20 plys of maple ... Does Chris Jennings have a web site to check this snare out (?) I'm very interested in seeing and maybe purchasing one ...

Dino and Rob - What will you both be doing for the next 18 or so days till next show as far as drum practice ... do you spend a little time per day on the kit or drum pads ... do you guys still take some lessons during DSO breaks or do you have a side project that you gig with ?

That's a great question. For me, I won't pick up a pair of sticks for about a week. The body just needs to decompress after a long tour. I recently moved, and am just getting the music room together. Haven't even set up a kit at home yet. Once I do, starting next week, I might spend 30-60 minutes a day, just messing around until I find something I need/want to concentrate on. I recently got a new stock of cymbals from Zildjian and will spend some time playing them all and figuring out which ones I really like.

I recently started playing bass, and I will probably spend more time with that than the drums. As far as playing out, I will be doing a few gigs with a project I play with when I am home. I'll also be sitting in with 2 or 3 bands. Just old friends that I play anywhere from a couple of tunes to bringing a percussion set up and joining for the night.

Both situations are a lot of fun for me. Playing with old friends is the real treat. Playing percussion only is a gret treat fro me as well. One of the things I most enjoy about it, is playing other music and rehearsing orginal stuff before the gigs. It really gives me the oppurtunity to get away from the GD thing and concentrate on other aspects of music. OF course, I will also go and hang with the local GD band, Jake's Leg. I used to go and hear them when I was a teenager, then spent my 20s playing in all kinds of different groups with the members, and now join them or sub for the full time guy whenever they need/want. It also gives me a chance to see old friends and go out and actually listen to GD music and enjoy myself on the other side of the rail.

I haven't had a lesson in a number of years, although I could sure use a few. I am in touch with my old teacher quite often. To be honest, just listening to any music and especially seeing bands live, is a lesson. There is something to learn from every musician out there and I am usually listening with the ear of a student.

[Vortex]

Dino your new snare sounds crazy, over an inch of rolled maple , thats sick ... I have a 13x6.5 Pearl Reference snare thats over an inch thick but its 20 plys of maple ... Does Chris Jennings have a web site to check this snare out (?) I'm very interested in seeing and maybe purchasing one ...

Dino and Rob - What will you both be doing for the next 18 or so days till next show as far as drum practice ... do you spend a little time per day on the kit or drum pads ... do you guys still take some lessons during DSO breaks or do you have a side project that you gig with ?

....Chris doesn't have website but I will contact him and tell him you may be interested. I'll get him to sign up on this board and you guys can talk it over. Warning.... his charge is not cheap.

Sounds like you got a pretty sweet snare too.

As far as what I will be doing... I'll be working on this stuff http://www.myspace.com/dinoenglish ... working on a ton of original music (please check out all the links to the different project pages). I just finished work on a sound track and I will be concentrating on finishing a CD by a band called The Dysfunctional. It's the first project I will am working on where I am producing but not playing on (they have there own drummer).

After I finish The Dyfunctional CD I hope to work on an original CD that will feature some if not all of Dark Star Orchestra.

I will also be getting my studio space together (the new Studio Vortex) at my new residence in Lexington KY. I'll have a kit set up so that I can jump behind it and record a new idea or if inspiration hits for practicing.

I actually do most of my technical drum practice on the road. I'll get about an hour of practice ... at least a half hour ever show day. It helps me warm up. I'm one of these guys that need to warm up to feel I'm on top of my game. Many players can just hit a performance without warming up and be great. That's not me. I have to work on it constantly.

[acududeman]

That's a great question. For me, I won't pick up a pair of sticks for about a week. The body just needs to decompress after a long tour. I recently moved, and am just getting the music room together. Haven't even set up a kit at home yet. Once I do, starting next week, I might spend 30-60 minutes a day, just messing around until I find something I need/want to concentrate on. I recently got a new stock of cymbals from Zildjian and will spend some time playing them all and figuring out which ones I really like.

I recently started playing bass, and I will probably spend more time with that than the drums. As far as playing out, I will be doing a few gigs with a project I play with when I am home. I'll also be sitting in with 2 or 3 bands. Just old friends that I play anywhere from a couple of tunes to bringing a percussion set up and joining for the night.

Both situations are a lot of fun for me. Playing with old friends is the real treat. Playing percussion only is a gret treat fro me as well. One of the things I most enjoy about it, is playing other music and rehearsing orginal stuff before the gigs. It really gives me the oppurtunity to get away from the GD thing and concentrate on other aspects of music. OF course, I will also go and hang with the local GD band, Jake's Leg. I used to go and hear them when I was a teenager, then spent my 20s playing in all kinds of different groups with the members, and now join them or sub for the full time guy whenever they need/want. It also gives me a chance to see old friends and go out and actually listen to GD music and enjoy myself on the other side of the rail.

I haven't had a lesson in a number of years, although I could sure use a few. I am in touch with my old teacher quite often. To be honest, just listening to any music and especially seeing bands live, is a lesson. There is something to learn from every musician out there and I am usually listening with the ear of a student.

Dino & Rob,

Thanks so much for filling us in on your snare drums. I have several snares that I have collected through the years. My first is a Ludwig Acrolite circa 1975 that I played through the 80's. I have a Pearl 6 1/2" Free Floater with both steel and maple shells. Chad Smith gave me a 5" Pearl Recording Series snare at the Modern Drummer Festival in '94. Recently I acquired a DW Craviotto 6 1/2" solid maple snare. Like yours, Dino, it's a beast and it sounds awesome. I also recently picked up a 4" solid maple shell Noble & Cooley. It looks to be about 20 years old.......not sure from the serial number. It sounds great too.

Rob, I saw Jake's leg in SL about 15 years ago........they were fun. See you guys NYE!

regards, reid.

[acududeman]

Rob Koritz & Dino,

Greetings! I have another drum gear-related question for you.

I've always loved the percussion sounds from Kreutzman/Hart circa 1969/70. In particular the ride cymbals and the snares.

My guess is that they were using 5" snare drums such as the Ludwig Supraphonic.......whatever they were they were super-sensitive w/ tightly tuned heads and tons of crack......orchestral almost. Have either of you guys ever discussed early drum gear with the GD drummers?

As for the rides, they sound so fricking great.......very thick w/ great stick definition and awesome bell sound. Vintage Zildjians I'm assuming........22"?

I sometimes wonder if those guys kept any of their vintage gear from the 60's.

It's ironic how, in my opinion, the more deluxe and fancy the GD gear got (drummers and guitarists), the less raw and aggressive the music became. In 68-70, the drumming is filled with rudiment-rich, subtle and nuanced snare and kick-drum work. The 80's drum sound was amazing in its sizzling crispness (partly Dan Healy no doubt), but I would have loved to be able to time travel back to the Fillmore circa '69 and catch me some vintage GD.......complete with Mickey working the gong during Dark Star.

Thanks to you both for keeping the beat so masterfully.

regards, reid.

[Vortex]

Rob Koritz & Dino,

Greetings! I have another drum gear-related question for you.

I've always loved the percussion sounds from Kreutzman/Hart circa 1969/70. In particular the ride cymbals and the snares.

My guess is that they were using 5" snare drums such as the Ludwig Supraphonic.......whatever they were they were super-sensitive w/ tightly tuned heads and tons of crack......orchestral almost. Have either of you guys ever discussed early drum gear with the GD drummers?

As for the rides, they sound so fricking great.......very thick w/ great stick definition and awesome bell sound. Vintage Zildjians I'm assuming........22"?

I sometimes wonder if those guys kept any of their vintage gear from the 60's.

It's ironic how, in my opinion, the more deluxe and fancy the GD gear got (drummers and guitarists), the less raw and aggressive the music became. In 68-70, the drumming is filled with rudiment-rich, subtle and nuanced snare and kick-drum work. The 80's drum sound was amazing in its sizzling crispness (partly Dan Healy no doubt), but I would have loved to be able to time travel back to the Fillmore circa '69 and catch me some vintage GD.......complete with Mickey working the gong during Dark Star.

Thanks to you both for keeping the beat so masterfully.

regards, reid.

Reid,

I have not discussed 60's era equipment with either drummers but I'm guessing you are right about the snares. The best thing to do is seek out pictures.

As far as cymbals in the 60's, yes they sound pretty thick. I forgot if I stated this before but I have a sizable collection of authentic Grateful Dead cymbals but i think the oldest I have is from he 78' era which includes a 22" Zildjian ride and some thin 18" crashes ...one with ribits!

From my understanding, that old equipment is no longer around. I used to be friends with one of Billy's techs and he stated that some of those old kits were sitting around in storage but that when they closed down their space in the mid 2000's he was going to try to get a lot of that stuff donated to local schools. ... not sure what actually happened to it.

[acududeman]

Reid,

I have not discussed 60's era equipment with either drummers but I'm guessing you are right about the snares. The best thing to do is seek out pictures.

As far as cymbals in the 60's, yes they sound pretty thick. I forgot if I stated this before but I have a sizable collection of authentic Grateful Dead cymbals but i think the oldest I have is from he 78' era which includes a 22" Zildjian ride and some thin 18" crashes ...one with ribits!

From my understanding, that old equipment is no longer around. I used to be friends with one of Billy's techs and he stated that some of those old kits were sitting around in storage but that when they closed down their space in the mid 2000's he was going to try to get a lot of that stuff donated to local schools. ... not sure what actually happened to it.

Excellent........thanks Dino.

That's very cool that you have those GD cymbals!