Health Care Bill Passes

[bs69]

Looks like a last minute executive order on abortion saved the bill.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35976595/ns/politics-health_care_reform/

How do you view this legislation?

[blythalala]

Looks like a last minute executive order on abortion saved the bill.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35976595/ns/politics-health_care_reform/

How do you view this legislation?

i view it as a step in the right direction. i think it's a bummer that abortion continues to be perceived as a "moral" issue and not a health issue (and find nancy pelosi a little terrifying), but it's step in right direction. i'll take it

[chuckvegas]

Trillion may mean:

Either of the two numbers (see long and short scales for more detail):

• 1,000,000,000,000 (one million million; 10¹²; SI prefix: tera-) - for all short scale countries - increasingly common meaning in English language usage.
• 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 (one million million million; 10¹⁸; SI prefix: exa-) - for all long scale countries - increasingly rare meaning in English language usage but frequent in many other languages.

"President Obama is expected to sign the $940-billion bill Tuesday."

Here in the Land of the Short Scale it still represents a lot of money.

[bs69]

i view it as a step in the right direction. i think it's a bummer that abortion continues to be perceived as a "moral" issue and not a health issue (and find nancy pelosi a little terrifying), but it's step in right direction. i'll take it

From what I understand, in cases where it is a health issue (or rape) abortions are not affected.

[bs69]

Trillion may mean:

Either of the two numbers (see long and short scales for more detail):

• 1,000,000,000,000 (one million million; 10¹²; SI prefix: tera-) - for all short scale countries - increasingly common meaning in English language usage.
• 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 (one million million million; 10¹⁸; SI prefix: exa-) - for all long scale countries - increasingly rare meaning in English language usage but frequent in many other languages.

"President Obama is expected to sign the $940-billion bill Tuesday."

Here in the Land of the Short Scale it still represents a lot of money.

To me it is simply a question of supply and demand. By passing this bill the government is increasing demand for health care services without increasing the supply. Costs can only go up. If they want to make health care more affordable they need to increase the supply first and then let demand grow to meet it. We need to get programs in place immediately to increase the future supply of doctors and nurses in this country or you all better get used to waiting for treatment.

[sakada]

right idea to address the shameful "health care" {more like "repeat business"} industry...THO, the dems have certainly bowed to the corporate "health" industry...what?! NO real public option?!?...i'm not so sure this will settle out well for most...let's instead look to universal health care as a RIGHT of the people and the RESPONSIBILITY of a federal gov't. to so provide...as note: Venezuela's constitution MANDATES that ALL citizens be covered...

[bs69]

right idea to address the shameful "health care" {more like "repeat business"} industry...THO, the dems have certainly bowed to the corporate "health" industry...what?! NO real public option?!?...i'm not so sure this will settle out well for most...let's instead look to universal health care as a RIGHT of the people and the RESPONSIBILITY of a federal gov't. to so provide...as note: Venezuela's constitution MANDATES that ALL citizens be covered...

Rights are things that don't infringe upon the rights of others. Such as: Freedom of speech, freedom to assemble, right to bear arms, etc. Right to have others pay for my healthcare does not fit in. You cannot possibly find a place to draw the line. Should everybody have the right to basic preventive health care? Maybe, but what about a liver transplant? Do I have a right to expensive cancer treatments so that I can live an additional 6 months?

[found]

Rights are things that don't infringe upon the rights of others. Such as: Freedom of speech, freedom to assemble, right to bear arms, etc. Right to have others pay for my healthcare does not fit in. You cannot possibly find a place to draw the line. Should everybody have the right to basic preventive health care? Maybe, but what about a liver transplant? Do I have a right to expensive cancer treatments so that I can live an additional 6 months?

I completely agree. Health is not a right, it's something you earn by taking care of your body and working hard so you have the money to get proper treatment in case of emergency. Granted, it is a great shame that some people lead very healthy lives and are unfortunately diagnosed with cancer, I don't think anyone else (tax payers and government) should have to pay for their treatment.

Government should just get out of our lives and let people take responsibility for their actions. I believe in evolution, so those who work hard and have the brains will have the means to protect themselves and continue with their lives. We're overpopulated to being with...

[blythalala]

From what I understand, in cases where it is a health issue (or rape) abortions are not affected.

i think that's right. i actually meant what i said in a much more general and philosophical sense, i.e. the way many people in this country perceive abortion as something separate, and therefore requiring special language, legislation, or -- in this case -- executive orders. it's great that there's a "health exception" in the case of risking a woman's life or of incest or rape (which are both criminal acts), but so many people seem not to view abortion procedures as having much to do with health at all.

but yay health care!

[New York Steve]

I completely agree. Health is not a right, it's something you earn by taking care of your body and working hard so you have the money to get proper treatment in case of emergency. Granted, it is a great shame that some people lead very healthy lives and are unfortunately diagnosed with cancer, I don't think anyone else (tax payers and government) should have to pay for their treatment.

Government should just get out of our lives and let people take responsibility for their actions. I believe in evolution, so those who work hard and have the brains will have the means to protect themselves and continue with their lives. We're overpopulated to being with...

Wow....really???

Evolution will take care of all our problems. Fuck em if they can't pay, let them die!!!

What would happen if you couldn't get insurance because of pre-existing position?

What would happen if your inurance company dropped you and you got cancer?

[found]

I'd have to take care of it my own damn self. I don't expect help from anybody... should I??? I think people rely too much on their government and other people's help. If i go into debt, I certainly don't run around begging people for money so i don't see why health i any different. Wealth = Health

Fuckin A, survival of the fittest, just the way nature intended.

Like i said, it's very unfortunate for people who get cancer and other terminal illnesses but people should prepare for this themselves. You never know what life holds around the corner so get off your ass and seize the day. Go the extra mile, get the extra dollar and one can sustain a healthy life.

[bs69]

Wow....really???

Evolution will take care of all our problems. Fuck em if they can't pay, let them die!!!

What would happen if you couldn't get insurance because of pre-existing position?

What would happen if your inurance company dropped you and you got cancer?

How far do you propose it should go? Is it the "right" of every citizen of this country to receive the best possible treatment for their cancer at no expense to themselves? Should the government spend millions on treatments for people likely to be dead within the year? Where does the money come from? (I don't mean to pick on people with cancer. I, like most of you, have had many relatives die of this dreadful disease. I am just using it as an example.)

[found]

How far do you propose it should go? Is it the "right" of every citizen of this country to receive the best possible treatment for their cancer at no expense to themselves? Should the government spend millions on treatments for people likely to be dead within the year? Where does the money come from? (I don't mean to pick on people with cancer. I, like most of you, have had many relatives die of this dreadful disease. I am just using it as an example.)

I agree. The government doesn't have millions, billions, or trillions to spend. We need to be fiscally conservative at this point. The American people are going to feel the brunt of this in the end.

[New York Steve]

I'd have to take care of it my own damn self. I don't expect help from anybody... should I??? I think people rely too much on their government and other people's help. If i go into debt, I certainly don't run around begging people for money so i don't see why health i any different. Wealth = Health

Fuckin A, survival of the fittest, just the way nature intended.

Like i said, it's very unfortunate for people who get cancer and other terminal illnesses but people should prepare for this themselves. You never know what life holds around the corner so get off your ass and seize the day. Go the extra mile, get the extra dollar and one can sustain a healthy life.

How about children who get cancer? How about people who are diagnosed in their teens and or 20's that haven't had the opportunity to stockpile money for the day they get sick? How about people who couldn't get insurance because a pre-existing condition?

Some people haven't had the opportunity that you speak of. Hard work doesn't always equate to wealth. and according to your argument, wealth will sustain your life. ( Excpet when you have a pre-existing condition and then you have to pay out of pocket.)

[acududeman]

Looks like a last minute executive order on abortion saved the bill.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35976595/ns/politics-health_care_reform/

How do you view this legislation?

To answer the original question, I am THRILLED that this bill passed......right on!!

[found]

If you feel so bad for these people why don't you just hand over all your money. I don't see why the government has to MANDATE that the citizens pay for other people's health. If you want to help out there are many charitable donations. Instead gov't wants to pay out the ass so everyone gets the same measly coverage and all is fair. Fuck that bullshit, I'd rather fend for myself. It's all about personal freedom and in this universal healthcare you don't have much choice except stick your thumb up your ass and whistle dixie until gov't takes care of you. If i got cancer today, I would no expect anyone to help out except for (myself) family and a few close friends and thats the way the cookie crumbles. Should I go beg people to go pay for my education and insurance, fuck no! If you want something done, go out and do it yourself.

Also as stated before, there are very unfortunate incidents and hopefully those youngins with terminal illness have a loving family that created a safety net for their children. If you can't prepare for the worst for your children, you're simply not fit to have any.

You gotta play the hand you've been dealt in life for better or worse. Sad but true and thats just nature. "Sometimes you eat the bear and well... sometimes he eats you."

I believe if you work hard, use your brain, network with the right people, sky is the limit as far as wealth is concerned. And as stated before, wealth = health.

Our country is simply not in a position to be spending all this money.

I think i've said more than enough to clarify my position on this topic.

[New York Steve]

Get off your liberal high horse. Stop asking how about this and how about that. If you feel so bad for these people why don't you just hand over all your money. I don't see why the government has to MANDATE that the citizens pay for other people's health. If you want to help out there are many charitable donations. Instead gov't wants to pay out the ass so everyone gets the same measly coverage and all is fair. Fuck that bullshit, I'd rather fend for myself. It's all about personal freedom and in this universal healthcare you don't have much choice except stick your thumb up your ass and whistle dixie until gov't takes care of you. If i got cancer today, I would no expect anyone to help out except for (myself) family and a few close friends and thats the way the cookie crumbles. Should I go beg people to go pay for my education and insurance, fuck no! If you want something done, go out and do it yourself.

Also as stated before, there are very unfortunate incidents and hopefully those youngins with terminal illness have a loving family that created a safety net for their children. If you can't prepare for the worst for your children, you're simply not fit to have any.

You gotta play the hand you've been dealt in life for better or worse. Sad but true and thats just nature. "Sometimes you eat the bear and well... sometimes he eats you."

I believe if you work hard, use your brain, network with the right people, sky is the limit as far as wealth is concerned. And as stated before, wealth = health.

Our country is simply not in a position to be spending all this money.

I think i've said more than enough to clarify my position on this topic.

Last question, which would you rather, health care or war in Iraq???

[found]

Honestly neither but for the sake of entertaining you... Health Care. I don't believe in violence to resolve disputes.

[Guest deadheadmike]

Last question, which would you rather, health care or war in Iraq???

can we have a door # 3 option ???

[blythalala]

Fuckin A, survival of the fittest, just the way nature intended.

somebody's done it! i'm speechless. truly. have no words.

[bs69]

How far do you propose it should go? Is it the "right" of every citizen of this country to receive the best possible treatment for their cancer at no expense to themselves? Should the government spend millions on treatments for people likely to be dead within the year? Where does the money come from? (I don't mean to pick on people with cancer. I, like most of you, have had many relatives die of this dreadful disease. I am just using it as an example.)

Bump for answers. It is not a matter of lacking compassion, we simply cannot afford it. I would like to donate to every charity that comes along, buy cookies from every girl scout and mulch from every boy scout that comes to my door, but I simply cannot afford it so I don't.

[Mango]

I agree. The government doesn't have millions, billions, or trillions to spend. We need to be fiscally conservative at this point. The American people are going to feel the brunt of this in the end.

Actually they do, it's just going to other places. Mostly places that you and I probably don't want it to, then again I've read some (in my opinion) absurd political outlooks on this board so I wont be surprised. ---i.e.--'we should spending our tax dollars to make weapons to stop the terrorists'....

Bump for answers. It is not a matter of lacking compassion, we simply cannot afford it. I would like to donate to every charity that comes along, buy cookies from every girl scout and mulch from every boy scout that comes to my door, but I simply cannot afford it so I don't.

Can't afford it??? I don't know the exact statistic but something like 20% of the population of the U.S. have 80% of the wealth. I guess that's just capitalism, right? Survival of the fittest? The problem with this health care situation is NOT that we can't afford it.

[found]

Bump for answers. It is not a matter of lacking compassion, we simply cannot afford it. I would like to donate to every charity that comes along, buy cookies from every girl scout and mulch from every boy scout that comes to my door, but I simply cannot afford it so I don't.

People try to think idealistically about their gov't. And in an imperfect world, you can bet your bottom dollar that gov't aint gonna be perfect for everybody. As bs69 said, it's not lacking compassion, its trying to analyze the situation from a realistic perspective.

Blue Dylan, please enlighten me on how you would tackle the situation because we obviously have boat loads of money. Enough for pork barrel spending at least.

[bs69]

Actually they do, it's just going to other places. Mostly places that you and I probably don't want it to, then again I've read some (in my opinion) absurd political outlooks on this board so I wont be surprised. ---i.e.--'we should spending our tax dollars to make weapons to stop the terrorists'....

Can't afford it??? I don't know the exact statistic but something like 20% of the population of the U.S. have 80% of the wealth. I guess that's just capitalism, right? Survival of the fittest? The problem with this health care situation is NOT that we can't afford it.

Yes, we can't afford it. We have a massive defecit and you can't keep going to the rich for money. I think the percentages are something like 5% controlling 80% (I am not sure either), but that is certainly not just Capitalism. We are all very wealthy in this country, it is all relative. Our poor would be considered wealthy in 80% of the world.

I just cannot understand the thinking that health care is somehow a right. Can anyone explain to me why they think that everyone has a "right" to healthcare without contributing to pay for the cost?

[Mango]

I'm sorry I even entered...