Happy Birthday Phil..

[chuckvegas]

This thread has been an interesting one to follow, for sure. And it reflects the increasingly diverse nature of the crew here. I think that is a good thing.

The article went on to say that alpacas don't seem to have the nature affinity for large bodies of water that, say, Labrador retrievers do. But after gentle coaxing and loving training he does very well.

[Dstone5553]

Like in a hot-fudge sundae?

Very funny Kimberlly!

[sonomajon]

Very funny Kimberlly!

That is one of those many words( when spelled correctly) in the English language that is a noun but moonlights as a verb...and then there is dessert which is pronounced exactly like desert(V)...but you can't get arrested for eating dessert...but you can go to jail for deserting the military...maybe I should desert this thread...and then of course there is Chuck in the desert..(one accented syllable changes everything) It must be challenging to learn the english language and all its nuances ...

[drpinky]

No worries Jon ... I'd really be more concerned with Jill Lesh's set list and vocalist choices ... some donations by faithful member's will help solve the bandwidth issue but not much can be done about Jill ...

Perhaps another constitutional amendment ...

[Rusty the Scoob]

My idea was more of who would do the job and a good job if something were to happen to Phil and I add that I feel the band could have carried on in the event of Phil passing ( not Jerry or Bobby )... and yes the sound would have change direction , but who's to say that would have been a bad thing ... Phil BOMBS rocking the GD stage would have been missed though , just like Brent's keys and vocals were after he passed ....

Sticking either of those bass players in the Grateful Dead would be like sticking Warren Haynes in place of Jerry. He's a great player but it just didn't quite fit.

Phil's style isn't just unique, it's completely opposite of anybody else's approach.

I guess bad mouthing them is saying I'd go see them again? Read my first couple of posts. My last post was supposed to be humerous. I guess I missed. Hey somebody has to be in charge. If Jerry was still alive maybe he would have a headset. Maybe Phil and Bobby should trade the headset every few songs. that would make things interesting.

There is a history behind the headsets. The GD all had headsets starting in about 1992 and continuing through 1995 They could all talk to each other - they all had a foot switch near their vocal mics that sent the mic to the headsets instead of out to the audience. Phil's the only one I saw talking on his with Furthur but they all used it back in the late GD days. You can find recordings of the backchannel audio sometimes and it's pretty funny.... they're swearing at each other, checking out girls in the front row, etc.

Personally I'm not a headset fan... I don't think the music is improved by verbal discussions in realtime while you're playing it. The best moment of either Furthur show I saw were when Phil and JK stepped forward a little and had a great musical one-on-one with everybody else holding back.

[chuckvegas]

they're swearing at each other, checking out girls in the front row, etc.

Some band members I know don't need headsets for that...

[neutrino]

There is a history behind the headsets. The GD all had headsets starting in about 1992 and continuing through 1995 They could all talk to each other - they all had a foot switch near their vocal mics that sent the mic to the headsets instead of out to the audience. Phil's the only one I saw talking on his with Furthur but they all used it back in the late GD days. You can find recordings of the backchannel audio sometimes and it's pretty funny.... they're swearing at each other, checking out girls in the front row, etc.

Do you have a link to any such recording? I'd love to hear some of that!

[VincentPuleo]

Rusty, good analogy with Warren... Phil is simply irreplaceable... just like Jerry and Bob.

I'd also love to hear some of those headset recordings.

[Rusty the Scoob]

Some band members I know don't need headsets for that...

Of course not. In most other bands we just talk about it afterwards while packing up the gear. Like I said, I'm anti-headset. But I'm pro listening to and laughing at the results!

As far as recordings, here's the only one have a link to offhhand: http://www.archive.org/details/gd95-03-29p.sbd.18096.sbeok.shnf

There's also a good recording of a 1995 rehearsal where they're working on Unbroken Chain and Here Comes Sunshine, trying to get ready to break it out at the Spectrum during the spring tour.

http://www.archive.org/details/gd95-03-17.soundcheck.sbd.17951.sbeok.shnf

[Dr. Barry]

Everyone has an opinion.

Mine is that while I agree that Phil was great with the GD and a vital member of the band, especially in the early years, I do believe that if he had left for whatever reason that the band could have gone on. Different yes, but they could have gone on. I loved Phil as much as anyone and thrilled to his playing (and singing) but I still believe what I am stating.

As I stated before, my opinion is that only Bob and Jerry were of the stature that would have stopped the band if either had left.

And I am sticking with what I implied earlier. Brent was a larger presence and a far more significant player and vocalist than Phil was in Brent's time with the band. In fact I would say that he was right there (just behind) with Jerry and Bob in terms of vital elements of the GD during his tenure, and his early departure left a void that was never filled well. Yet the band did continue without him, but it was a devastating loss to a true genius who did much to help shape the sound that many of us 80's deadheads find feels like home.

All opinions. Loved it all. Loved Brent alot and not afraid to say it (and LOVE when Barraco does Brent!).

Dr. B

[neutrino]

Of course not. In most other bands we just talk about it afterwards while packing up the gear. Like I said, I'm anti-headset. But I'm pro listening to and laughing at the results!

As far as recordings, here's the only one have a link to offhhand: http://www.archive.org/details/gd95-03-29p.sbd.18096.sbeok.shnf

There's also a good recording of a 1995 rehearsal where they're working on Unbroken Chain and Here Comes Sunshine, trying to get ready to break it out at the Spectrum during the spring tour.

http://www.archive.org/details/gd95-03-17.soundcheck.sbd.17951.sbeok.shnf

Thanks Rusty!! I had no idea such recording existed. In a small way, it kind of lets you into the inside workings of the band. I'll have to find a few more of these recordings. I'd also love to hear some of the recent headset feed of what Phil is saying to Furthur during a show.

[John A]

There is a history behind the headsets. The GD all had headsets starting in about 1992 and continuing through 1995 They could all talk to each other - they all had a foot switch near their vocal mics that sent the mic to the headsets instead of out to the audience.

I believe that Cal Expo '92 was the debut of the headsets. Another off shoot was that the headsets obviated the need for the floor monitors, which served to unclutter the sound on the stage.

[Rusty the Scoob]

Everyone has an opinion.

Mine is that while I agree that Phil was great with the GD and a vital member of the band, especially in the early years, I do believe that if he had left for whatever reason that the band could have gone on. Different yes, but they could have gone on. I loved Phil as much as anyone and thrilled to his playing (and singing) but I still believe what I am stating.

As I stated before, my opinion is that only Bob and Jerry were of the stature that would have stopped the band if either had left.

And I am sticking with what I implied earlier. Brent was a larger presence and a far more significant player and vocalist than Phil was in Brent's time with the band. In fact I would say that he was right there (just behind) with Jerry and Bob in terms of vital elements of the GD during his tenure, and his early departure left a void that was never filled well. Yet the band did continue without him, but it was a devastating loss to a true genius who did much to help shape the sound that many of us 80's deadheads find feels like home.

All opinions. Loved it all. Loved Brent alot and not afraid to say it (and LOVE when Barraco does Brent!).

Dr. B

Phils presence was reduced quite a bit during the Brent era because he was bored through a lot of it IMHO. He never played anything too interesting on most Bobby tunes to begin with, and when Jerry was on H he didn't even have those tunes to look forward to, and really changed his focus from the music to his kids. IMHO he's playing better and more passionately now than he did through most of the 80's.

Brent's presence was huge because his B3 was loud and awesome, and his vocals were very prominent. His contribution to creating the music that we all love was pretty limited, though... his original songs were mediocre to terrible, and the number of great tunes written in his tenure pales in comparison to the ones written before.

Opinions are all fine. I know people who think the band was never as good after Pigpen died! Doesn't mean I have to agree with them, or not think that they're crazy.

I believe that Cal Expo '92 was the debut of the headsets. Another off shoot was that the headsets obviated the need for the floor monitors, which served to unclutter the sound on the stage.

Yep, a soundman's dream! By all accounts it really changed the dynamic of the band though... most of them wanted only themselves in their ear mix, so interaction was pretty much stifled.

Ah, yes... reading through the comments on the Archive show...

Phil seems to have himself turned up pretty loud in the mix with Jerry and the drums right behind. To my untrained ear, Vince and Bobby seem to be almost non existant in the mix. If you like Phil, check this out. He stands out loud and clear. 4 stars for the novelty of it.

Interesting, that's exactly how I'd build my onstage mix when I can. My band discovered by trial and error that we play better when our "Jerry" and I were on the same side of the stage, and neither of us are hearing too much of "Bobby" or the keys. It seems to work best when Jerry plays, Phil responds primarily to him, Bobby and Keys respond to both of them and each other, and Jerry reacts to the overall sound to close the loop. The drummers just keep pounding back there, reacting to each other, in charge of some song transitions, influencing the dynamics, keeping the time, etc.

And that's my main problem with Furthur... JK either isn't taking the initiative or is being held back from really leading the way he should to make the music sound right, with the right band dynamics IMHO. I'm not ready to give up on them yet, though.. I already like them much better than P&F or Ratdog.

[Dstone5553]

All this talk about headsets gives the impression that these guys were in the studio or something.

Don't know if this has already been stated but I think people know the earpieces were designed and used to create a mix for each musician separately as well as help their long term hearing, which blaring monitors can harm.

So Phil had a different mix than Weir and so on.

The recording of them are pretty funny too.

Phils presence was reduced quite a bit during the Brent era because he was bored through a lot of it IMHO. He never played anything too interesting on most Bobby tunes to begin with, and when Jerry was on H he didn't even have those tunes to look forward to, and really changed his focus from the music to his kids. IMHO he's playing better and more passionately now than he did through most of the 80's.

I think that may be true for the 90s...I recall Phil saying he didn't remember doing anything that special as a band during that time period.

In my mind, Phil was a monster in the 80s...he couldn't be stopped, contained or slowed down. He was the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.

And the saying that when he was on the band was on was as true as ever then.

[John A]

...when Jerry was on H he didn't even have those tunes to look forward to, and really changed his focus from the music to his kids. IMHO he's playing better and more passionately now than he did through most of the 80's.

I agree with this, particularly the extra passion that was missing for Phil's latter stages with The Dead. But I'd use Mr. Stone's 90s time frame. That said, I think he became more inconsistent later in the 80s, less often taking over shows, songs, or jams by essentially playing lead bass.

[Guest deadheadmike]

I said.. "Saying "F**k Phil, John, and Furthur" is completely wrong"

I'm confused... deadheadmike I think you are misunderstanding me... I don't believe I added in John, that was definitely in the post, might have been a different one or edited out.

Vince , things looked as they did to me by the way the 2 post lined up , yours and fishmans , I was wrong and I apologize to you ... I never saw the post that bag of mixed nuts and bolts Sister Blackbeard was referring to , so this was one big confusion that got out of hand and again I apologize to you and everyone involved for adding to the mess ...

I've blamed a few people for adding wood to the fires that have been popping up here lately and it looks like I have my own pile of fire wood ... the only fires being tended to should be the camp fires at Grateful Fest this summer or whatever festival is on your summer vacation list ... there seems to have been a line drawn in the sand by some of us over the obvious issues and discussion that have been ongoing here for the past few months ... every time we get to a point of calmness and understanding something sets the fire a blaze and the line gets redefined ... its time to put out the fire for good , wipe the line out and just enjoy everything as it is and everyone as we are ... life is short and our time here is limited , so lets not waste it , lets enjoy it ...

[acududeman]

Vince , things looked as they did to me by the way the 2 post lined up , yours and fishmans , I was wrong and I apologize to you ... I never saw the post Sister Bluebird was referring to , so this was one big confusion that got out of hand and again I apologize to you and everyone involved for adding to the mess ...

I've blamed a few people for adding wood to the fires that have been popping up here lately and it looks like I have my own pile of fire wood ... the only fires being tended to should be the camp fires at Grateful Fest this summer or whatever festival is on your summer vacation list ... there seems to have been a line drawn in the sand by some of us over the obvious issues and discussion that have been ongoing here for the past few months ... every time we get to a point of calmness and understanding something sets the fire a blaze and the line gets redefined ... its time to put out the fire for good , wipe the line out and just enjoy everything as it is and everyone as we are ... life is short and our time here is limited , so lets not waste it , lets enjoy it ...

Yes, please...........

[VincentPuleo]

no worries Mike!

[Dstone5553]

The final Deercreek show is out there in this monitor form, you can hear Jerry talking about the cameras looking like gun sights , they had the lights on in the audience for the whole show, I had heard there had been death threats made to Jerry before and this monitor SBD kind of verified this parking lot tale. I'm sure it's on www.archives.org in the year 1995.

Great Dire Wolf 3rd song in with Garcia pleading with the crowd not to murder him.